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T O P I C R E V I E W
dusty
Posted - 12 May 2012 : 02:48:26 AM I posted this on the "Message" thread, but I decided to start a thread for it because I'm really curious about this aspect of 9 and what 9s have to say about it. I feel it very strongly in myself.
I've been listening to the 9 segment and there are a lot of things resonating with me, especially the below, which comes up a lot for me and recently has really been on my mind.
quote:...the joy of having found the right thing to do, the right activity, the right relationship, something to really love, and then they're unstoppable. And that's actually when 9s most like themselves, when they're involved in an activity where they are above the inertia, there's no questioning anymore, and they're devoted to something they really enjoy.
The idea of becoming devoted, and looking for something to become devoted to. I think that once I have this then I would be pulled into life, and I really feel like I would be unstoppable if I had this raison d'etre. I kind of think of myself as a lost planet, adrift, and what I want is a sun to revolve around, orient myself to, devote myself to, live for, something that gives me purpose and animates me. Well, really, in my case it's someone. The idea of living for another is very compelling to me, what I feel I'm meant for.
I was wondering, do 9s think of themselves as planets in need of a sun?
25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First)
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 9:26:29 PM yes, you can be/have both.
you'll meet your juliet queen when you least expect it.
mmm, i can't wait to be fantastically tired from a good, hard day's work again...
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
eidbuser
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 9:13:21 PM Lake, it's so surprising.
These past days I've been so preoccupied and working so intensely, I haven't really had the time to introspect. Now, after a hard day's work, I talk to you, and I'm flooded again with my romantic feelings. I've been feeling so physical lately and not really emotional at all. But there is this sensitive romantic side that feels so different. Maybe I can be/have both at the same time.
My feelings flow for women very easily. But often my feelings have over-ridden my physicality to the point of negation. I think what I want is to feel this sweet pleasure within my own body. A unity of heart and body.
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 8:10:14 PM
quote:Originally posted by eidbuser
best to you too, lake. i have a lot of empathy for you.
thank you, truly.
quote:i think one of the reasons why I talk about suffering so much, is not just to be an 'actor' playing the part of suffering person, but because of a perception that people in the world try to deny suffering so much. I think this may actually be more prevalent in america. So I try to bring attention to it in some way. That might actually be the "role" that I'm "acting" - the messenger boy of suffering.
YES. i see that too, and it physically hurts me.
quote:I think you've made me realize something though. I actually remember being strongly affected by love songs when I was a very young child, between 3 and 4 years old. That makes me realize that some deeply romantic quality has been in my nature since I was very young; it may have been something I was born with. I tried to think if it started when I was in my teens, but I think it re-emerged at that time.
i'm sure you were born this way.
i think i was.
quote:Originally posted by whitelila
Where is dusty? I like reading her post.
I want to go swimming. Walk at night. dream.
I want I want I want.
xoxo
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
whitelila
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 8:01:34 PM Where is dusty? I like reading her post.
I'm taking x again because i'm bored. and i'm drinking. I want to go swimming. Walk at night. dream.
I want I want I want.
eidbuser
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 8:00:29 PM best to you too, lake. i have a lot of empathy for you.
i think one of the reasons why I talk about suffering so much, is not just to be an 'actor' playing the part of suffering person, but because of a perception that people in the world try to deny suffering so much. I think this may actually be more prevalent in america. So I try to bring attention to it in some way. That might actually be the "role" that I'm "acting" - the messenger boy of suffering.
I think you've made me realize something though. I actually remember being strongly affected by love songs when I was a very young child, between 3 and 4 years old. That makes me realize that some deeply romantic quality has been in my nature since I was very young; it may have been something I was born with. I tried to think if it started when I was in my teens, but I think it re-emerged at that time.
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 7:47:17 PM i think i may know what you mean.
i miss being in love.
i miss the cozy, everyday love most though--the accidental moments of heavenly perfection.
what *could* have been if we each had been able to be more present to ourselves, and to one another, hollows me out.
it was the right decision though--the loving thing to do.
our love still exists somewhere...i have to keep telling myself that.
i'll be fine.
i'll fill myself up, and meet someone else one day whom i'll share something magical with.
that is what i dream of, and perhaps why your posts hurt so much.
anyway, best to you, EU.
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
eidbuser
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 7:27:19 PM There was so much written that I appreciate and would like to reply to that I don't have time to. But this stuck out to me:
quote:the fact that you so openly express that you're hurting, and a coupled implied want/need for someone to try and be there for you, but when someone does make an effort, if they can't meet you *exactly* where you're at, then their efforts don't seem to 'count' with you.
This strikes me. I think I suffer because there's a part of me that longs for something very specific and deep, something very special, almost otherworldly. I think this part of me also suffers deeply for not having it, and rejects anything that's "not it." So when people give me attention or try to help, it only further highlights this sense of things not matching up to the longed-for-ideal.
This is the 4ish part in me and in everyone (to varying degrees). It's a kind of suffering and longing that nothing ever seems to fulfill, except that you get rare glimpses of it from time to time in your life. This is related to what you say here:
quote:that instant-fated-unspoken-deep-connection-and-understanding stuff is very cool and sexy
It's this kind of sadness and long-suffering desire for something so profound, intimate, and touching that nothing in the world seems to fulfill it. This gets triggered in me when I sometimes meet a woman that arouses this instantaneous falling-in-love-at-first-sight. The enrapturing ecstasy of new love. I get glimpses of this wonder from time to time in my life, and those have been the moments where I have felt some of the greatest happiness.
Spiritual experience is incredibly blissful, but sharing a spiritual experience within a human romantic and sexual relationship seems to be one of the greatest things you could ever experience.
I think that the source of this deep sadness is having felt such incredibly rarefied heights of emotion, and then falling far far down below this level where the whole of reality seems to be transported into a higher dimension.
Being in love is like heaven on earth. And I've often been in a place where being out of love makes me feel as though life is hell. In that place, nothing quite matches up to the ideal of what once was, what could have been, or what could be.
shakti
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 06:27:36 AM Thank you for engaging with EU, Lake. I realize that I have needed to form some type of way of holding it and your post brought things into focus for me.
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 06:18:29 AM Thank you for being here and sharing, shakti.
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
shakti
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 06:11:39 AM
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 06:04:05 AM
quote:Originally posted by shakti
quote:Originally posted by Lake
I'm also sure I've alternately held back too much, and then over-stepped boundaries, b/c that's my blind spot.
A passion for connecting with people that makes you a bit skittish about doing it perfectly?
*places hand over face and nods*
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
shakti
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 06:01:54 AM
quote:Originally posted by Lake
I'm also sure I've alternately held back too much, and then over-stepped boundaries, b/c that's my blind spot.
A passion for connecting with people that makes you a bit skittish about doing it perfectly?
shakti
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 05:52:42 AM Yeah, your examples are along the lines of James Hillman's Soul's Code. Thanks for posting that. It's evocative in a way that includes a type of arrival in darkness that may be an early hint perhaps in hindsight of a potentiality that wanted to manifest.
One of the greatest of these mysteries, Hillman believed, is the question of character and destiny. In his bestseller The Soul's Code, he proposed that our calling in life is inborn and that it's our mission in life to realize its imperatives. He called it the "acorn theory" the idea that our lives are formed by a particular image, just as the oak's destiny is contained in the tiny acorn.
London: In The Soul's Code, you talk about something called the "acorn theory." What is that?
Hillman: Well, it's more of a myth than a theory. It's Plato's myth that you come into the world with a destiny, although he uses the word paradigma, or paradigm, instead of destiny. The acorn theory says that there is an individual image that belongs to your soul.
The same myth can be found in the kabbalah. The Mormons have it. The West Africans have it. The Hindus and the Buddhists have it in different ways they tie it more to reincarnation and karma, but you still come into the world with a particular destiny. Native Americans have it very strongly. So all these cultures all over the world have this basic understanding of human existence. Only American psychology doesn't have it.
London: In our culture we tend to think of calling in terms of "vocation" or "career."
Hillman: Yes, but calling can refer not only to ways of doing meaning work but also to ways of being. Take being a friend. Goethe said that his friend Eckermann was born for friendship. Aristotle made friendship one of the great virtues. In his book on ethics, three or four chapters are on friendship. In the past, friendship was a huge thing. But it's hard for us to think of friendship as a calling, because it's not a vocation.
London: Motherhood is another example that comes to mind. Mothers are still expected to have a vocation above and beyond being a mother.
Hillman: Right, it's not enough just to be a mother. It's not only the social pressure on mothers by certain kinds of feminism and other sources. There is also economic pressure on them. It's a terrible cruelty of predatory capitalism: both parents now have to work. A family has to have two incomes in order to buy the things that are desirable in our culture. So the degradation of motherhood the sense that motherhood isn't itself a calling also arises from economic pressure.
London: What implications do your ideas have for parents?
Hillman: I think what I'm saying should relieve them hugely and make them want to pay more attention to their child, this peculiar stranger who has landed in their midst. Instead of saying, "This is my child," they must ask, "Who is this child who happens to be mine?" Then they will gain a lot more respect for the child and try to keep an eye open for instances where the kid's destiny might show itself like in a resistance to school, for example, or a strange set of symptoms one year, or an obsession with one thing or another. Maybe something very important is going on there that the parents didn't see before.
London: Symptoms are so often seen as weaknesses.
Hillman: Right, so they set up some sort of medical or psychotherapeutic program to get rid of them, when the symptoms may be the most crucial part of the kid. There are many stories in my book that illustrate this.
London: How much resistance do you encounter to your idea that we chose our parents?
Hillman: Well, it annoys a lot of people who hate their parents, or whose parents were cruel and deserted them or abused them. But it's amazing how, when you ponder that idea for a little bit, it can free you of a lot of blame and resentment and fixation on your parents.
London: I got into a lengthy discussion about your book with a friend of mine who is the mother of a six-year-old. While she subscribes to your idea that her daughter has a unique potential, perhaps even a "code," she is wary of what that means in practice. She fears that it might saddle the child with a lot of expectations.
Hillman: That's a very intelligent mother. I think the worst atmosphere for a six-year-old is one in which there are no expectations whatsoever. That is, it's worse for the child to grow up in a vacuum where "whatever you do is alright, I'm sure you'll succeed." That is a statement of disinterest. It says, "I really have no fantasies for you at all."
A mother should have some fantasy about her child's future. It will increase her interest in the child, for one thing. To turn the fantasy into a program to make the child fly an airplane across the country, for example, isn't the point. That's the fulfillment of the parent's own dreams. That's different. Having a fantasy which the child will either seek to fulfill or rebel against furiously at least gives a child some expectation to meet or reject.
London: What about the idea of giving children tests to find out their aptitudes?
Hillman: Aptitude can show calling, but it isn't the only indicator. Ineptitude or dysfunction may reveal calling more than talent, curiously enough. Or there can be a very slow formation of character.
London: What is the first step toward understanding one's calling?
Hillman: It's important to ask yourself, "How am I useful to others? What do people want from me?" That may very well reveal what you are here for.
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 05:34:43 AM I think he's smart and working on himself too.
What you say about EU being a performance artist makes me think about what I read somewhere along the lines of the kid who likes to slice open frog bellies with an exacto knife in his free time (to see what they're made of, and/or perhaps b/c the feeling of slicing through flesh just does *something* for him) becoming a highly skilled and praised surgeon--instead of a serial killer, and even instead of a butcher.
Part of why I actually decided to become a chiropractor is b/c I have a natural urge to connect with, and/or help people, while also having a violent streak
Maybe EU will turn his flair for the dramatic into becoming a spiritual leader who gives moving sermons/speeches
I told him in a private email that he seems to have been given the gift of having people pay attention to him--that he affects people.
I'm coincidentally alternately hyper-aware and unaware of personal boundaries. Boundaries are my blind spot. So, EU, please forgive me if Ive over-stepped yours in a violating way.
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
shakti
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 05:00:02 AM
quote:Originally posted by Lake
if someone really cares about you, then they will show you interest and compassion, but it helps them to know what exactly they're dealing with.
Agreed. If it is clear to him.
I think he is a very insightful and smart person who is working on himself, but somehow there's a particular thing he does that may potentially be in his blindspot. He seems to be able to take on the role of the suffering one and play it convincingly and that is potentially confusing to him and others (not just related to his type, but also whether it is authentic, and if so, what might be a response to his post). It has an exhibitionistic aspect. I don't know what it is about. I imagine with time, it will become clearer. Perhaps it is a part of being able to evoke inner states for others to see, if so, he can't help but do what he needs to do, it's like discovering a calling to be a type of performance artist through finding out how the same show continues to have powerful impact on the audience. I don't know. It makes a big difference from the point of view of intimacy to know whether it is a show or something that requires a different type of response (rather than bravo, or how this affects me is..., cool very disturbing), and from everything he has been saying more recently he seems to be functioning and not in any type of severe distress.
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 02:40:31 AM maybe at some time in the future, it would be interesting to hear you talk about your parents, and more of your life story.
that^ stuff always helps me understand a person better--where they "come from", yanno?
if you feel generally misunderstood, and like people you have some sort of spark (friendly or romantic) with can't meet you where you're at, then that's one long term investment to help remedy that.
knowing what you want, need, and expect out of a relationship, and sharing that with the other person also helps, naturally.
if someone really cares about you, then they will show you interest and compassion, but it helps them to know what exactly they're dealing with.
if you want deep understanding from, and connection with, someone, help them through the process, please.
you have to be involved in the process of getting to know the other person as well. give and take. if someone you thought you had something with really isn't seeming to *get* your side of things, perhaps there is a reason for that. maybe there is something you are missing. ask questions. listen. try.
there are going to be those times though when you and the other person just cannot find common ground, and that's okay (i actually can appreciate it a great deal when someone disagrees with me, and is brave enough to frank with me about it, as it allows for true honesty, respect of individual freedom of choice, and love to enter the picture, and/or be reinforced). it's going to happen eventually, and (depending on the magnitude and/or particular circumstances around the difference of opinion) that is when you get to see what your relationship is truly made of (as well as what each of you are truly made of).
so... yeah, i didn't want to just say "you're a hard guy to get to know" and then tell you why, and then leave w/o offering some sort of 'solution', so that's why i'm back promoting communication as a means of cultivating satisfying, long-term, intimacy
...though that instant-fated-unspoken-deep-connection-and-understanding stuff is very cool and sexy
not gunna lie, i'd like some of it myself... (no, i'm not hitting on you )
(btw i'm writing this for my own benefit just as much as yours. i need to learn how to be a better communicator. big time.)
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
Lake
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 01:30:01 AM
quote:Originally posted by eidbuser
Lake, I resonate with that a lot, actually. Apparently I am a lot like Romeo. That whole passage seems like it could apply to me, especially the part that you quoted.
i'm glad.
how am I a hard guy to get to know?
well, this:
quote:Often, I don't think I'm interacting with anyone except myself.
and the fact that you so openly express that you're hurting, and a coupled implied want/need for someone to try and be there for you, but when someone does make an effort, if they can't meet you *exactly* where you're at, then their efforts don't seem to 'count' with you.
it's frustrating that the guy who replies often doesn't seem to know the guy who was venting/calling out for help/whatever in the first place.
if you don't want attention, then why are you running around bleeding in various rooms in here?
of course that's^ going to upset people. it's painful to watch.
i know i hurt when i read your romeo-esque monologues. so, when i see that you reject others who want to be there for you, i selfishly kinda want to shoot you to put you out of your misery so i don't have to listen to your suffering. i can't stand watching suffering. again, it hurts.
i know a lot of this makes me sanctimonious. so, i'll also try and swallow this bitter pill i'm handing you.
i'm glad to read that things are going better for you. and, for the record, you don't have to be happy all the time, but going on and on as you can do raises a red flag for me, but, if you truly are 'okay', and are just expressing yourself then that's cool. i'll just let you be. i would hope that if you really were going through an actual, serious something (ie feeling suicidal) that you'd differentiate by saying clearly what was going on.
bottom line, it's hard to tell what's *real* with you, and one seems to need to possess a magic skeleton key, as well as telepathy and/or empathic psychic abilities to get through all your locked doors.
also, i find you generally stingy, but then randomly, and charmingly, very direct with your feelings of positive regard. it's confusing. again, what is real?
i know i've decided to take you less seriously than i originally did, b/c you confuse the heck outta me. so i just want to detach, and i have. i still like you though--i just think i'll like you more from further away.
lastly, this is all^ going to weird you out, i know it. you're going to wonder where it's coming from. but, from reading your posts on here, and the little we've interacted in private, i've started to like you and get attached, as people do--not just me, clearly.
be well. i'm going to be gone for a bit.
*it's not about finding yourself, it's about realizing who you've been all along.
eidbuser
Posted - 27 May 2012 : 04:10:09 AM I wasn't looking for any response. Interesting feedback; I didn't know it'd be too much for you. I thought you deserved at least some level of explanation.
Often, I don't think I'm interacting with anyone except myself.
Take care though.
enforest
Posted - 27 May 2012 : 02:55:49 AM This is too much for me, eidbuser. There are some things you should keep for yourself and not show others so flagrantly because of how it will impact them emotionally. I'm not upset, but I am just not interested at seeing all of your insides exposed in this light. I feel you're disregarding the way in which I signed off in my last post.
You take up too much space sometimes without consideration for your reader, for the person interacting with you.
This said, I don't have much else to say about what you wrote because I don't want to get entangled in your emotional issues at this time. Maybe just tell you that as much as I called what I did in my e-mail to you unloving, it was more like my love was distorted than not present. To say I didn't feel fond for you as I wrote you hateful words would be a lie. I felt many things, many ups and downs in one moment. Many motivations.
Here's a quote from Rilke: Perhaps all the dragons in our lives are princesses who are only waiting to see us act, just once, with beauty and courage. Perhaps everything that frightens us is, in its deepest essence, something helpless that wants our love.
I'd like to take a break from interacting with you on this. I'm saying this so that you don't think I'm ignoring you if I don't respond to you.
eidbuser
Posted - 27 May 2012 : 02:15:52 AM I think this is a good issue to explore. This situation highlights certain things that are important to me in a friendship/relationship as well. When you wrote me what you did, it felt very shocking and out of the blue since we hadn't communicated for a while. Your message felt insensitive and that you didn't understand where I was coming from because you already had so many ideas, images, assumptions, and conclusions about who I was or what I was experiencing. It really felt like you were just relating to some negative image that you have of me, and giving me a piece of your mind. In certain respects you were quite accurate, in others you were way off. But overall, even the accurate parts were still about little parts of my ego-personality and it seemed that you had excluded who I am as a whole. Perhaps that is part of the ambiguity of text communication, or when you are responding to these sectors of my personality that I express online and take them to be all of who I am.
I have also been going through a lot of positive changes recently that you may not have fully understood at the time, which made your message seem even more out of touch with who I am and where I am. With every passing day, I feel less and less like the person who I was yesterday. I think that getting out into the world and working more has gotten me more and more out of the usual confines of my ego-structure. It feels analogous to the shedding of an old skin, and it feels as though I'm becoming a new person.
As I express these resurfacing sensitivities, longings, and wounds of a needier, younger self, I'd want these to be held with sensitivity, gentleness, kindness, understanding, and empathy. That's also what I expect and require from my relationships. I felt very attacked and wounded by you, so in that situation I felt no obligation to respond or communicate with you in any way. Even though I knew you wanted it and were looking for it, out of respect for myself, I didn't feel it was appropriate for me to care about your needs or to try and take care of you after the insensitivity you showed me. There was also an element of passive-aggressive revenge, as I knew that my withholding would be painful for you on some level. But after your apparent disregard for hurting me, I didn't really care whether my lack of response would hurt you or not. Other than the bonus of hurting your feelings, I didn't feel any point to have to justify or explain myself to you and correct your misunderstanding of me.
I'm also beginning to realize that after all this time you haven't really understood the nature of what I am expressing on these boards. It is often a form of cathartic purging for me, and is meant to be the antithesis of getting trapped in my ego, although it may appear the opposite at first. So that makes me feel like you still haven't "gotten" me this whole time, which adds insult to injury.
You've also said:
quote:I don't understand why it is you never answered me after the message that I wrote off board. If you didn't like it, didn't agree with it or were angry with me, then why not say so to my face? To me, that cheapens the connection because it means I can't show you my fears, my anger or hatred towards you without you running away or just not showing up, and I won't be privy to those things coming from you. It doesn't feel honest to me, and it feels very limiting. How can you heal the wounds, set the record straight if you don't talk about it??
These are actually things that I value highly in a relationship as well. But my overall reaction was more of hurt than of anger, and it's becoming clearer and clearer to me that that's the main reason why I didn't respond to you. I want to stress how little compassion, sensitivity, love, or caring there was in what you wrote me, which you yourself stated was lacking in your follow-up.
In my mind you had turned into a kind of heartless, cruel, insensitive, critical, hostile monster; much like my father. You didn't seem to care at all about how I felt, and were actually attacking me for my feelings. I think I actually would have responded if I felt like you actually cared and had a heart, instead of just being wrathful towards me.
I'm also beginning to recall something I've read in Almaas's work. It has to do with how we split our positive and negative feelings in our relationships, our love and our aggression. I am actually open to having conflict in a relationship and working things out that way, but I notice that that's actually only really possible when there is a fundamental foundation of love in a relationship. If I feel really uncared for and unloved in that situation, there's no way I'm going to invest my energy into resolving a conflict.
Although what you said had some judgmental attitude of trying to 'show me the light,' which is an attempt at being helpful in some abstract way, there wasn't any sense of love in it. That's why it felt like your message was actually more for yourself than for me, in some kind of need to tell me what you think is wrong with me.
All in all, this is deepening my understanding of compassion. I don't know if I've really felt much of that in our relationship. Even though I can appreciate working things out through conflict in relationships, I don't think I want to do it with someone whose love, caring, sensitivity, and heart I feel shuts down when they are upset.
One positive thing I'm taking away from this for myself is seeing how I withdraw from people that I see as uncaring, hurtful, insensitive, and unloving. How I withdraw from others out of hurt and fear of pain. It's starting to get me in touch with my own compassion, and this feeling like maybe I can be with my own hurt even when someone else isn't being kind toward me. I don't necessarily have to collapse when someone else is being mean to me. It feels like there may be a way that I can hold my own pain and still stand my ground.
Yeah, as I sit with that, it seems that I didn't want to respond to you or be open with you - as someone that seems uncaring and hurtful. I wanted to protect my sensitive heart from pain.
enforest
Posted - 27 May 2012 : 12:35:39 AM
quote:Originally posted by eidbuser
Interesting turn of events. I don't mind talking to you when you aren't being so presumptuous. It seems like on some level your heart is in the right place and that you're trying to help me from what seems like an accurate perspective. But when you act insensitively and then demand a response, it feels very manipulative to me.
I feel present to my experience, and that I'm not running away from it. I'm already trapped, and when I am with it or express it, it frees me up. It may not look like it to an outside observer, but it often leads me into a deeper place of letting go. I feel more free these days than I ever have been in my life.
Certain thing you wrote me had an effect on me. It hurt, and made me look at myself and question things about my self. But it didn't feel safe or comfortable to talk about these sensitive issues with you when on some level it feels that you're more interested in yourself, even though on the surface it appears that you're trying to be of help to me.
It makes me somewhat sad and confused that you wouldn't want to speak to me anymore. I respect your decision; but I also feel open to talking if you ever want.
I genuinely like you, eidbuser. It's just that after this conflict it feels more apparent to me that our friendship lacks something that I strongly need from human interactions. I'm not opposed to writing to you in the context of this discussion board, but the idea of keeping regular ties with you doesn't appeal to me at the moment. Given your reaction to my behaviour, I don't feel you're willing to explore or engage me on the level that I need from others close to me. Instead of faulting you for that, I'd rather just accept the difference and move on. I already spoke about why I wasn't in agreement with the way you reacted to me, but underlying that for me is the reality that I would be lying to myself, not taking myself seriously if I did anything more to right the wrong I've felt or to ignore how it is I felt about your reaction and continue to have deep discussions with you. It may be something normal to you to withdraw like you did and to justify it on my bad behaviour, but ultimately we are in disagreement about this. It's not the first time it happens either, and I think it's just revelatory of how we don't connect on a certain level. A level that's important to me. I don't disagree for the most part about your observations about me. I just don't resonate with your way of dealing with violence and aggression.
Anyway, I think I've covered the matter. I won't hesitate to talk to you on here in the context of two forum members on a discussion board because I'm not interested in creating false boundaries between us (i.e. shunning you). Just that my heart is not open to investing more depth in our friendship for the time being. And know that it's not without some hesitation that I choose this, because I'm just plain horrible at setting myself limits. I think you know well how I function.
Take care and I'll see you around.
eidbuser
Posted - 26 May 2012 : 6:28:50 PM Lake, I resonate with that a lot, actually. Apparently I am a lot like Romeo. That whole passage seems like it could apply to me, especially the part that you quoted:
quote:Montague. Many a morning hath he there been seen, With tears augmenting the fresh morning dew. Adding to clouds more clouds with his deep sighs; But all so soon as the all-cheering sun Should in the furthest east begin to draw The shady curtains from Aurora's bed, Away from the light steals home my heavy son, And private in his chamber pens himself, Shuts up his windows, locks far daylight out And makes himself an artificial night: Black and portentous must this humour prove, Unless good counsel may the cause remove.
Benvolio. My noble uncle, do you know the cause?
Montague. I neither know it nor can learn of him.
how am I a hard guy to get to know?
dusty
Posted - 26 May 2012 : 10:47:20 AM
quote:Originally posted by thomg
This thread strikes me as very non-sx-first, apart from EU.
And 9w1 central.
Btw, EU, agreed about your 5 head fix.
I agree that my idea of devotion doesn't have to do with sx (and I never thought that it did) but it's also really not 9ish. I just thought that it was for superficial reasons.
But maybe you haven't read most of the stuff I've deleted; are you talking about devotion or what I've had to say about it?
enforest
Posted - 26 May 2012 : 03:41:10 AM I'll answer you tomorrow (or later today, since it's early morning here), eidbuser. I got back from the bar a few hours ago and realized that post I had been working on got eaten up by my browser. Should have saved it. I'm just too hungry and tired to concentrate on the topic like I want to right now.
thomg
Posted - 25 May 2012 : 11:18:47 PM From what I know of you, you fit the classical triple withdrawn, but had always wondered about your reactivity. But 6 connection, sx/sp and 4 fix all explain that. That's all obvious.
Not sure what tipped me over ... I think it's gestalty ... triple withdrawn more than triple doubt. And, thinking of the whole history of your posting on the board, there is, even if it's head-fix last, a strong desire to know, analyse and be open to knowing without being so quick on the epistemological trigger as a 6 fix. You have more patience re knowledge, being in it for the long haul as a value, as well as a tool.
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