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Synergy
Member
USA
4360 Posts |
 Posted - 10 Mar 2003 : 3:27:43 PM
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Symbols! Archetypes! Mystery! 3 of my favorite words! 
You needn't have any knowledge of Archetypes to "play" this game. (Although, self-discovery and meaning may be a neat side benefit!)
What animals, trees, objects do you identify with? List as many qualities you can about them. Are there any correlations to your life, personality, or interactions?
Here are some links to get you started. http://thecards.com These are a GREAT set of Archetypal cards that I have, used for RPG and divination. (Btw, I'm giving them a test run on others, so if anyone wants a free reading, send me an email with your question or the area you'd like insight in. Don't use yes/no questions, though. Yes, you heard right. Free readings!)
A 4w5 friend gave me this link today http://www.jung-soul.com/Jungian-Archetypes.html
Information on Arkies common to all http://myss.com/Archs.asp
A partial list of Arkies and how they show up in theater, books, movies, etc. http://myss.com/ThreeArchs.asp
If you don't feel like delving too deep, keep it simple. Look around you. What do you collect? Does it reflect a part of your personality? A thread that runs through your relationships?
Which types of movies do you like? Do consistently cast yourself in the HERO role? The UNDERDOG, or VICTIM? Something else?
What are you good at? What is your bliss? If you could turn it into a character or Archetype, which would it be?
Do any of the "characters" you play interact consistently with others? Do you find that you clash with VICTIMS, and wish they'd stop whining? Do you want to kick them? Are you a BULLY? (COWARD?) Do you seek to RESCUE them? EMPOWER them? Ignore them?
Just some thoughts to get you going. Let's play!
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Edited by - Synergy on 10 Mar 2003 5:43:30 PM |
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jase
Member
USA
3488 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2003 : 7:13:48 PM
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I ran through the list of arkies and checked those that I seem to particularly identify with (shadows galore):
Alchemist
Destroyer
Detective
Dilettante
God
Guide
Wounded Healer
Mentor
Puer
Prince
Saboteur
Seeker
Student
Vampire
Well, lots to think about. I'll have to sleep on it. |
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raz62
Member
USA
1281 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2003 : 9:15:14 PM
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My favorite Arkie is Bill Clinton ( I know, that's pretty bad . . .)
I have always identified with cats and foxes, so I guess I'd look into what that means in terms of archetypes. First I want to find a song for Mordred.
"Dream like you'll live forever . . . Live like you'll die tomorrow"
(from unknown source) |
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Synergy
Member
USA
4360 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2003 : 10:03:29 PM
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Jase, I found your list fascinating, because a lot of them are Arkies that I very much feel aligned with. If you don't mind me asking:
What made you put God? Quite frankly, I've always wondered what person would identify with a God Archetype! A lot of women head straight for the godesses, and identify themselves with one out of mythology. But God? Tell me more, if inclined.
Alchemist: this is one that fascinates me, and I still wonder if I have it/use it. I'm very much into redeeming "lead" into gold, but perhaps that is more Destroyer/Phoenix stuff...I'm not sure. What made you pick it?
Destroyer: why this one? Where does it seem to manifest? Do you identify with Phoenix, too?
Wounded Healer: I'm surprised! Wow. Could you elaborate on this one, too?
Fellow Detective ^5 Same with Guide.  What made you pick Guide over Teacher?
Vampire: I've always been drawn to Vampires and have a "thing" for them. I've even called myself an "information vampire". Yet, I fail to see this energy in my life, largely because I feel like I don't drain people or suck out their life force. How do you see it from where you stand? I have cast Seductress/Tease in my 2nd Wheel, though.
Student: Do you follow "teachers"? I consider my "student" energy a part of a Teacher/Guide. I study for knowledge sake (Scholar?), but seek to eventually pass that knowledge wisdom on to others.
Prince: fascinating. Care to elaborate?
Seeker: I've wrestled with this one because Detective seems similar to this. I think I have Seeker in my 2nd Wheel. (I have cast it, but am not sure of its accuracy like I'm sure of the 1st Wheel.) My husband calls me a "lost soul", though, and that's supposedly a shadow of Seeker. Hmm.
What fairy tales or stories have you resonated with in life, Jase? Do you see them correlating to any of the above? If these questions are too personal, just ignore me.
Raz you may find this link interesting. http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/4076/index1.html I'm sure cats and foxes are on there. Foxes=wily, intelligent, tricky. Maybe you have Trickster? What part do you like about them?
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Dark Angel
Member
Hong Kong
3242 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2003 : 10:59:28 PM
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Angel
Destroyer
Detective
Hero/Heroine
Knight
Mother
Mystic
Poet
Rebel
Seeker
Student
Teacher
Thief
Warrior
These are the one I pick, probably need to sit on it and do some thinking.
Carrie  |
Edited by - Dark Angel on 11 Mar 2003 11:05:06 PM |
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dd1
Member
USA
1313 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 04:42:19 AM
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Synergy, here's what I have it down to so far. I have included the 4 required (Myss), am I assuming correctly one is to pick 1 child?
Judge
Engineer
Knight
Student
Teacher
Nature Child
Victim
Prostitute
Saboteur
Companion
Seeker
Dreamer
1w9 |
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carlos
Member
4113 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 06:08:49 AM
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Child: Magical/Innocent
Clown (Court Jester, Fool, Dummling)
Detective (Spy, Double Agent, Sleuth, Snoop, Sherlock Holmes, Private Investigator, Profiler--see also Warrior/Crime Fighter)
Knight
Lover
Monk
Prince
Prostitute
Rebel (Anarchist, Revolutionary, Political Protester, Nonconformist, Pirate)
Saboteur
Scribe
Seeker (Wanderer, Vagabond, Nomad)
Servant (Indentured Servant)
Student (Disciple, Devotee, Follower, Apprentice)
Thief (Swindler, Con Artist, Pickpocket, Burglar, Robin Hood)
Trickster (Puck, Provocateur)
Victim
(i guess i went over the limit of 12...)
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pimptress8w7
Member
USA
373 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 5:38:00 PM
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This is kinda interesting. Some of these screamed at me when I glanced over them, others just kinda hide from me.
Caregiver
Healer
Sadist
Seductress
Artist
Child
Disciple
Femme Fatale
Martyr
Seeker
Avenger
Rescuer
Trickster
I always have very vivid dreams and alot of times there are beautiful trees in them. Sometimes not so beautiful but I would say 90% of my dreams there are trees. I was told once that trees represent knowledge?
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Synergy
Member
USA
4360 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 5:48:08 PM
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(Note: if I'm being too nosy, just ignore me.  )
Carrie, tell me about DESTROYER for you. (If inclined) I find it interesting that you, Jase and myself alone identify with this energy, yet, you go to the Myss boards, and I don't think I've ever seen anyone claim that. Even Myss says in her workshops that people won't clain the "dodgy" Archetypes by claim the "glamorous" ones. (Kinda silly since every Archetype has its strengths and weaknesses). I think Destroyer/Phoenix is in my 2nd Wheel, though, not my first.
MOTHER...interesting. How does that manifest for you, not having biological children?
KNIGHT...interesting! Other than one other female, I don't believe I'ver seen anyone else claim Knight. How does this work for you?
THIEF? Do elaborate!
MYSTIC? How does that work with you?
dd1, according to Myss' model, you have 12 in your first Wheel, including the 4 common to all. In the outer wheels, however, other CHILD Archetypes can manifest. For me, I just call mine "CHILD" because I'm not sure if it's WOUNDED CHILD that's prevalent or MAGICAL CHILD. So even though, under the Myss model, we have 12 Archetypes in our first Wheel, there are outer wheels to consider, too, so we're not just using 12 Arkies...it's just that they're (theoretically) the patterns we most engage in to help fulfill our Contracts.
That's pretty facinating you picking both STUDENT and TEACHER. Neat. What made you feel they were separate, as opposed to STUDENT being a part of Teacher? Also, how does DREAMER work with you? Athens considered Dreamer as a part of his Wheel, too, but we couldn't figure out if that's a part of his ENGINEER/INVENTOR or another Archetypal pattern altogether.
Carlos! Thanks for stopping by to play! You can have more than 12, as I said. If someone really wanted to delve into personal Archetypal patterns, I'd highly recommend the book Sacred Contracts only because of the great questions listed to "ask" an Archetype when "interviewing"/examining them, etc. I definitely knew you had SCRIBE, with watcherr and all. I love Nag for his TRICKSTER! (He IS a 7w8, right? LOL) If you don't mind, share how TRICKSTER works for you. I've never met anyone else that has claimed this energy before! (Other than myself). What parts of CLOWN do you use? THIEF? What's up with that? <protects pockets from Carrie and Carols. . Monk? You must be the horniest MONK ever to... Nevermind.  SERVANT? Tell me more! I think I have this is my 2nd Wheel!
All, one of the Moderators at Myss shared some notes on one of Myss' workshops where she talked about different paths we're all on to fulfill our Contracts. They are the following: (Courtesy of my friend and Myss Moderator Martie Hughes, spiritual intuitive extraordinaire! http://spiritualintuitive.com/pages/179746/index.htm)
quote:
The Path of the Peacemaker - One who carries the gift of peace. Working to refine it in themselves, then refining it in others. The networker perhaps, one who builds consensus, one who forces others to look at an issue or a problem from a different perspective. One who stands up for the side not present. Nelson Mandela, Yassir Arafat, King Hussein all walk the path of the peacemaker. The nice lady down the block who can always find the other side of a problem and get very different groups of people to see things in a common way is, perhaps, walking this path.
The Path of Service - One who is driven to be of service. Caretakers, servants, nurses, doctors, nurses, clergy, are often walking the path of service. A mother who takes care of her children may not necessarily be walking that path, though she may think so at 10 o’clock at night when the kids are just getting into bed and she still has three loads of laundry to do before her day is done.
The Path of Love & Harmony - One whose life purpose is of unconditional love. Jesus walked a path of love & harmony. The great poets - Emily dickinson, Thoreau - those who have had a lifetime of experiences of the lonely heart. Also the great mystics, the hermits, isolates. The paradox in the Path is that one walking the path, quite often, is alone. Mother Theresa absolutely walked a Path of Love & Harmony. Some might think she walked a healing path or one of service. She was on a path of Love and Harmony. She taught it, lived it, among those who many believed were the least loved. The Path was Love & Harmony, her vehicle was service.
The Path of the Artist - A path of illusion, beauty, glamour. A path of creativity. A medium through which creativity is borne to the earth. Mozart, Picasso. Musicians, artists, actors often walk the path of the artist. Again, the nice lady down the block who makes everything she touches “beautiful”, who searches for beauty in every situation & shares it with others. Lemonade out of lemons might well be The Artist’s motto. Hairdressers, makeup artists, costume designers. Writers, too.
The Path of the Healer – One who heals without ego, who separates the act from the outcome. While many think of themselves as healers, one who is truly walking the Path of the Healer heals without ego. The act of healing is separate from the outcome. To take the person who is lame and make them walk; to take the sick and make them well. Unconditional healing. Doing the work regardless of the outcome. (Even within ourselves.)
The Path of Compassion - One whose life experiences demand a lack of judgment, exceptional empathy, a TOTAL lack of need to understand “why”. Teachers. Judges. Buddha. Lao Tse. Some of the great Mystics. Padre Pio. The mother of a murdered child who can honestly, wholeheartedly forgive the person who murdered the child is, most likely, walking a path of compassion.
The Path of the Rational Mind - This is the place for the left-brained individual. Scientists, philosophers, those who spend their lives working with law and order - lawyers, cops - many people who see the world only as black and white, who ask WHY to most everything, may be walking this path.
Frankly, I'm not sure which path I'm on. I can't tell if it's an Archetypal thing, or a Path thing with me. I think it's either Compassion, Love and Harmony, or Peacemaker. I feel I have SERVANT in the 2nd Wheel, as opposed to the Path of Service.
I've mentioned my main Arkies, but I'll list them here in case someone missed them in the past:
QUEEN-WARRIOR
TRICKSTER-PROVOCATEUR
REBEL
HEDONIST
DETECTIVE
MYSTIC
TEACHER/GUIDE
JUDGE
(And the 4 common to all: Sab, Prostitute, Child, Victim)
In my 2nd Wheel, these are my guesses: (I haven't worked extensively on this set. The first wheel is STILL yielding much insight for me!)
LIBERATOR
DESTROYER-PHOENIX
SERVANT
COUNSELOR/ADVISOR
LOVER
SEEKER
TEASE/SEDUCTRESS
PROPHET (CASSANDRA)
NETWORKER
HERMIT
ADDICT
Thank you all for your input!
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Edited by - Synergy on 11 Mar 2003 5:51:24 PM |
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Ocean
Member
4460 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 9:18:16 PM
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I need to whittle down...
addict
athlete
several child's
gambler
wounded healer
hedonist
judge
lover
mediator
rebel
samaritan
seeker
servant
student
vampire |
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Synergy
Member
USA
4360 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 10:04:59 PM
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pimptress, I'm not sure about tree symbology. I do know they make for great analogies and insight! That's neat how you have a lot of trees in your dream. I tend to have a lot of buildings, elevators, etc., and I'm usually matching wits with someone while "escaping" because I have valuable information or some other caper.
Johnb, Cheetah, Ocean, and Pimptress, thanks for playing, as well. In light of the Arkies you've picked, do you see them working in tandem (or at cross purposes!), and with other people's Archetypes? (E.g. TEACHER with STUDENT, MOTHER/FATHER with CHILD, etc.?)
Cheetah, you never cease to delight me with your stinkerliness. (I'm going to give John a run for his money in making up words!) My interest in astrology is more from a personality/Archetypal standpoint. I don't check my horoscope, although I do get relevant daily transits in my email when they are about to occur, as well as New Moon information. I'm not too deep into it like some people, and I certainly don't schedule my life around it! I use it as a holographic model with regards to personality influences...much like my interest in Archetypes. I don't believe in it, per se. It doesn't govern my life. Nor does Tarot.
Now, about Tarot...
Let me give you some background. Ever since I was a child, I've been able to "see" things. (I have the twisted urge to say "I see dead people".) Some say I'm psychic. I especially have the ability to see big picture things, but I also can give "prophecies" and know certain information. (Clairaudience, clairvoyance, and all that jazz. And no, I can't see lottery numbers. LOL) It's similar to the prophets in the Bible, but I also have a teaching gifting that takes what I see, and incorporates it into a teaching model, analogy, or concrete example so a person "gets it". I have foreseen things that have happened before (years before), so I have a pretty good track record.
When I was in traditional Christianity, Tarot, astrology, and divination (except "directly from God" stuff) was strictly prohibited. After I came to the realization that God is truly love and doesn't plan on frying anyone's[blocked due to guideline #4 violation]indefinitely and brutally, I started to have other paradigm shifts. These shifts have taken me into studying some New Age materials, Buddhism, astrology, energetics, etc. I'm able to synthesize this with what I feel is the "bottom line" (spirit) of the Bible. (As opposed to "the word"...literal interpretation that ends up "bringing death".)
I believe that anything can be used to bring meaning to life, and help us become more conscious. I don't follow anything blindly and without question. (Except God. Teeheehee).
I understand the "odd" part. I appear to be full of paradoxes on some levels. Been called "an enigma" quite a few times, too. (Not to mention being so misunderstood. <faints in pseudo 4ness> ) Somehow, it works! LOL I'm sure you can look at my Arkies and see how they may work separately or in tandem with one another. That's what makes us all so unique in expression, but common in experience.
Here's a funny bit o' irony. I met with a Pastor friend of mine today, and I'm going to be his Assistant Pastor. He's going to the church board on Thursday with his non-negotiable decision. (Not bad for a 6 with a strong 3/9 connection!) I was really surprised. I've known him since I was like 14 years old! He's come to me for advice, and was friends with my first husband, a well. I've "seen" things for his church and with particular people before, and he hasn't listened. Years go by, and they come to pass. After awhile, I got tired of the "I should have listened to you!" But today, he's on the verge of burnout, and realized he needs help, and his weaknesses/that which drains him happens to be my strengths. (Counseling, conflict resolution, visionary leadership and teaching, etc.)
Sooo...it looks like I'm going back into the fray of traditional Christianity...quite unexpectedly! Of course, they don't need to know that I'm a borderline heretic with questionable interests! I'll just use what I know, add to what they accept, and believe it will benefit all involved. I'm still kinda reeling, actually.
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Edited by - Synergy on 11 Mar 2003 10:05:32 PM |
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coffeezombie
Member
USA
2961 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 10:19:57 PM
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I like:
Alchemist
Child: Eternal
Detective
Dilettante
Liberator
Midas/Miser
Mystic
Rebel
Scribe
Seeker
Student
Vampire
Visionary
I feel I identify most with the Mystic Hermit. I've always felt most identified with the Hermit in the Tarot Major Arcana. I identify with Vampire second most, as I've always been interested in the night and with bats, although I have a phobia of having blood taken from me.
CZ 5w4 |
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Dark Angel
Member
Hong Kong
3242 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 10:26:07 PM
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Hi Synergy,
Thanks of giving me an opportunity to organize my thoughts, since I have 14 on there I probably need to take 2 out.
Destroyer (Attila, Mad Scientist, Serial Killer, Spoiler)
In high school time, I learn about world history, Kali the goodness of destruction come to my knowledge and is fascinated by her existence. When I look at nature, things always happen in creation, disorder, destruction than rebirth like the 4 seasons interchanging forever. Life and death is a cycle, no beginning and no end. Without destruction, there is no room for creation.
I remember reading folk tale, about death. Everything he touches dies, flowers he like lost their color the moment he touches it. There is a child be friend with him; he dare not touch the child one for fear of loosing him. One day the child is sick and the moment he touches the child, his life is gone. It is the fear and lonely of the death that I remember the most. The heart of death is gentle and cherishes all living and beauty but because he is the death, he faith is lonely.
I have a tendency to pull things apart to understand them sine I am young, I usually can¡¦t put them back and my mom will be screaming me for breaking something that is functional. However my rebuilt skill getting better and better as I age. Without destruction there won¡¦t be creation and through destruction the most pure and truth will usually remain as the root and ground for rebuilt.
Come to think about it I think my nephew have destroyer in him as well. He builds a structure then takes it all apart and start all over with different design.
Mother (Matriarch, Mother Nature)
I choose this one is mainly connection to Mother Nature. In high school, I belong to gardening club and really got quite a green thumb. In University I joined recycling group though not much contribution. Environmental friendly is always part of me, and I always prefer a paperless office and I think my colleague had heard me ask, ¡§How many tree did you kill?¡¨ as a question when seeing major print out. When I see stacks of papers I got instant headache.
Mystic (Renunciate, Anchorite, Hermit)
He He I did mention my childhood dream is becoming a hermit. It think this is due to my health level had drop to level 8 when I was young. I find interacting with human being is a pain and truly desire to remove myself form society. It seem the idea to many is a pain but to me it seem is peace and quiet. On top being so alien to my own feeling, I use to pride my high pain torrance though this is just type 5 cut off form their own feeling.
I also find out that when I am on a mission (something I believe in) I will usually risk everything until I got the result I want. Pain is not something needs to consider, as it is not important. I use to amaze when people scream in pain as I wonder what is the use of it. Is it by screaming that the pain will reduce? It is better to start working on the reason causing the pain instead and shorten the duration of the pain.
Knight (see also Warrior, Rescuer)
When I have buy into a vision, I will through all my resources and energy to perfect it. It is also not a surprise as I am tested high on Implementer. The cause is something wing 6 believes in, I can be blind follower, yet there is a romantic sense in it as well. With type 5 as core to judge, decide and action on, truly is the loyal employee that slave over for the company without asking anything in return. I truly believe I did make a difference and make a impact at that time with the limited resources, the consequences is my health deteriorate very much. When you are busy, you forget about the pain. Am I noble, never thought about it that way but at least it is ethical. All I know is I get the job done at the right time and make the right decision in the situation. Somehow I feel energetic spiritually but not for my own benefit but because I have done something needed to be done. Strange is if I find myself in the same situation again, I probably will do it again.
When I see people with less capability I tend to want to help in the ways I can. Sometimes by helping others I got myself in trouble and need to do more things to set the old wrong to right. Yet I can¡¦t seem to keep my nose out of trouble so I guess I bring it all to myself without any gain on money, recognition or power. May be a want recognition so that would be somewhat like the knight¡¦s honor.
Thief (Swindler, Con Artist, Pickpocket, Burglar, Robin Hood)
On the first look Thief and Knight seem total opposite of each other. Yet when I look at thief I am thinking someone who uses their wisdom and skill to overcome an obstacle. Thief has a lot of pride in their skill and they like to be discreet and work in the shadow. They do not seek glory but they did leave their mark on the deed they do.
Among all Greek/Roman gods, I like Herms/Mercury a lot. The god of thief, moral, road, medical.
Carrie |
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Ocean
Member
4460 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 11:12:57 PM
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| LOL, hey! Im just a few towns over from Amityville! What a bunch of slimy crap that story was. |
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john
Member
USA
3817 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2003 : 11:28:10 PM
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hey ocean
if you are just a couple of towns away from amityville then you are just a couple of towns away from me unless its in the same direction then it could be my town. i greww
up in the town where the kid sued the school because he graduated but couldn't read. i wasn't the kid does your town have an alberts pizza?
john 5/4/social/sexual/intp |
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carlos
Member
4113 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 12:28:11 AM
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quote:
I love Nag for his TRICKSTER! (He IS a 7w8, right? LOL) If you don't mind, share how TRICKSTER works for you. I've never met anyone else that has claimed this energy before! (Other than myself). What parts of CLOWN do you use? THIEF? What's up with that? <protects pockets from Carrie and Carols. . Monk? You must be the horniest MONK ever to... Nevermind. SERVANT? Tell me more! I think I have this is my 2nd Wheel!
actually, syn, we never found out if nagraagog was a 7 or a 2w3... i mean, really, he just wants to help...
anyway, CLOWN... this comes out especially in groups of friends or with strangers, especially when i just meet a female... i'll intentionally act kind of silly to get a laugh or smile...even if inside i'm really serious as a heart attack... it's a way of breaking the ice... and with groups, it's just a way of creating a fun atmosphere... but then sometimes i get insecure about it cuz i think people won't take me seriously later on... it feels kind of deceptive...
MONK-- yes a horny and perverted monk, but a monk nonetheless... actually , do you remember when i was going to start my church? my fundamental idea was that we needed to keep the idea that sex was sinful and evil in our ideology because it created such intense horniness-- by making something taboo, it increases the desire to indulge in it... i mean, some of the descriptions of sexuality you read in fundamentalist writings are so [blocked due to guideline #4 violation]ing nasty, i love it!!! so anyway, in this church i was founding, the idea was to keep the idea of good and evil, except that we would be allowed to indulge in both...!
SERVANT/INDENTURED SERVANT-- this is kind of personal... it has to do with not feeling free,... like you have to work and suffer for a certain amount of time to buy your freedom... physically having to work to make a living, whether you want to or not... spiritually having to "pay your dues"... and also the idea that humility and selflessness are important and bring blessings... it's also a way of contributing, even though there's suffering involved
THIEF-- lol, i'm not giving away my secrets!
TRICKSTER-- well, i like to [blocked due to guideline #4 violation] with people's minds... i get an impression of what their hang-ups are, what their illusions are, where they're insecure, and then i kind of change, deceive, mock, shock, just mind[blocked due to guideline #4 violation]... doing or saying something completely unexpected to throw the person off-guard, never letting them get settled... soemtimes this is a defensive reaction, sometimes i do it for fun, sometimes i do it because i think the person needs it or deserves it... it's a kind of chaotic, wild energy where you're playing with deceptions and illusions... maybe stepping a little on toes... hoping that something good comes out of it all but not really caring if it goes bad... i feel it as a kind of creativity |
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dd1
Member
USA
1313 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 05:33:07 AM
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Hi Synergy, I see them quite differently. I see the Student always operating in the background, coming to the front on a regular basis as some opportunity presents itself. The Teacher is not always there, however there seems to be a pattern which repeatedly plays out as well. (Sometimes even by default) I'll end up having to do a presentation or be put in a position where I'm the instructor (I don't usually go looking for it); and when I'm done, people are sometimes suprised at how well it went.
I chose the Dreamer because at times I'm able to see the possibilies, but not necessarily always my own. (at times they are my wife's and not my vision for an example) so I chose Dreamer instead of Visionary. At times I can flesh out someone elses vision with more possibilities or details than they had seen. I'm also not afraid to act on them. Lately I have been geting better at dream interpretation as well. I also am getting better at sensing which ones have some meaning and which ones are just fluff. This is a skill I'm still finding my way in though.
1w9 |
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Ocean
Member
4460 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 09:57:36 AM
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John, I travel to your town for pizza - IAalia(sp?), across from K-Mart where I buy some of my best clothes for $10. I live in the archetypically named town devoted to material and sensual pleasure! Its the town where town hall didnt learn to read either. I wonder if they sued themselves.
...Ocean |
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Kali
Member
2703 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 11:58:17 AM
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"i can see the four common archetypes according to myss:
child
prostitute
sabateur
victim
and:
artist
alchemist
seeker
mystic
wounded/healer
persephone
hedonist
gambler"
ooops, pilot error, seem to be having trouble distinguishing between the edit and reply buttons. |
Edited by - Kali on 14 Mar 2003 10:27:37 AM |
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Udolpho
Member
Canada
515 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 6:31:43 PM
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i added a picture to my profile a few days ago, which is my 'personal' card in that deck, which is the deck i use the most and feel closest too. in that deck, its the 4 of cups, which i thought apt for an enneagram site... 4 of hearts. the description is:
"Polly, the Four of Cups, spends much of her time shut away, yet she is desperate to make new friends. Polly is always searching for someone or something, yet when opportunities arise, she seems uninterested and doesn't take the next step."
i went to thecards.com site and the card i drew was the moon, which is apt, because that is one of the important symbols in my life. though its not on the myss site, i would have to add it to my list.
"The Moon looks slyly out from her home in the heavens and peers with pride upon the night. She is the wisdom of the ages as enshrined by femininity; she is shadow, secrets and nighttime. The Moon knows that often the best way to show a good path is by hiding it in shadow."
so my list would be...
child - puer
moon
poet
vampire
student
princess
destroyer
monk/hermit
mystic
shape-shifter
muse
i feel kind of silly, because all the ones i chose are rather romantic, yet i cant seem to help it. its funny, all the vampire people here. i strongly identify with that... coffeezombie, i have the same fear of getting blood taken! needles are a phobia for me, and so are mosquitos. i also could never cut myself. i have a theory about suicidal people and vampires... it seems to me that a disporpotionate amount of suicidal people are drawn to vampires. when i was suicidal i felt that i wanted and desired death, but now that i am no longer suicidal, i see that i am terrified of death. especially the idea of myself ending. if everything dies, what is the point of life? might as well kill yourself because there is no point in liveing, youll just die anyway. so suicidal people [sweeping generalisation] are drawn to vampires because vampires survive death and become immortal. i just think its odd/funny. you say you want death, but what you really want is not to die. or to have life not to end, even though you want to end your life.
at one point in my life i did feel that i sucked peoples energy, because i was starved for it. i felt i had a black hole inside of me that sucked everything into it, and yet was still empty. i felt people would abandon me if they found out i 'took' their energy. later, i came to see that i just have an unusual way of dealing with energy, in that i spend it very quickly. i actually give off a lot of energy to others. but then i get to points where i have no energy left, and i dont seem to get any, and i become like someone sick or wounded. i then take energy from others, if i can, without giving any. but once i have my energy up to a level where i am no longer wounded, i spend that energy very quickly and generously. so, i dont feel too badly about taking peoples energy now. at a time, i did feel badly, and so rejected everyone around me, pushed everyone away, and that just made me hurt worse. once i was able to reach out to people, i did much better. i think this comes out in the muse archetype, because ive been muse like to other people in my life, giving others inspiration. i think this is me when im just radiateing all that energy out. although sometimes the negative muse is sparking creativity in others, but not being creative oneself, or giving people energy but not saving enough for yourself.
im reminded of a friend of mine, we got into a converstaion about monster archetypes.... i was the vampire, and he was the zombie. looking at the list, im sure he would also have Beggar (Homeless person/Indigent), and possibly Servant also, which relate to it. monsters are great archetypes. i find it so hard to seperate archetypes, because they seem to blurr into each other. everyone should have a monster as an archetype. heres something i free-wrote about vampires last year when i was trying to get people around me to pick their monster-type:
"Vampire
Oh Vampire, oh black hole turned into itself, sucking in all the light around it - yet never filling that void, that loneliness. And as each thing disappears into the abyss I only feel emptier, emptier. A tear in the fabric of reality, a tear tearing my face in two. I'm so cold as I lay awake at night, staring into the dark - give me your life, your warm blood, the thing I lost long ago. Death - that bright explosion/implosion and yet I'm still walking around, still felt, still measured. I'm a negative number. Yes, I intellectualize too much, (self)absorbed on my immortal life - the days spread out into years for me to watch and analyse, see all the things I've done wrong and the people who've left me. Yes I wallow in the muck of black, dark, death, sinking deeper into myself, deeper into life, my life, un-life, and un-lived life."
im not depressed, i was just remembering when i wrote it.
i could go on and on, but now im feeling rather shy, perhaps ive said too much. and ive only talked a bit about vampires! the way i live my life, symbols are everywhere. but i rarely get to share them with people. i changed my name 3 years ago, which for me was a symbolic gesture... related to the shape-shifter, in that i seem to re-make myself at different times in my life. or maybe the destroyer, i self destroy, and then remake myself from the ashes. though i dont quite think i have a pheonix archetype... i dont have the fire element nor the sense of light and newness and joy. |
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Synergy
Member
USA
4360 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 7:57:28 PM
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(Btw, if anyone is interested in an Astro House "cheat sheet", here it is. Very simplistic. http://www.spiritualastrology.com/article7.html)
Cheetah wrote: quote:
I hope you realize that I hold you in the highest regard when I say this, but, this church isn’t the First Church of Amityville, is it?
LMAO! Let's just say it's actually a denominational Pentecostal church that has over 12,000 churches in the US alone, with 2.5 million worshippers. I know...I know. God has such a wicked sense of humor!
What a cool bug story. Hey, I'll trade you 1/2 of my prophecies for 1/2 of your ability to catch butterflies. Whaddya think?
Anyway, what a wonderful synthesis of how you see some Archetypal energies working in tandem! Wow. That's some great insight you got going there. Interesting how the role of VICTIM and AVENGER, especially. It could be that VICTIM works (natally...that is, what predisposition you came in to this world with...which obviously moves around to different houses in different scenarios) for you primarily in your Unconscious (12th House?), or perhaps in the 7th House of Relationships. I have VICTIM in this House, myself.  Fortunately, it's pretty strong now, so I rarely, if ever, see myself as a VICTIM anymore. However, I need to keep my eyes open to see if I'm "victimizing" another! Thanks so much for your response. I look forward to reading any more insights you may have.
Carrie, you're most welcome! What a beautiful post! I've never heard Death described like this quote:
The heart of death is gentle and cherishes all living and beauty but because he is the death, he faith is lonely.
WOW. I totally get it. I have a strong DESTROYER. My Sun and a crapload of planets are in Scorpio/8th House (some in 7), so I'm very comfortable with that life/death cycle. (House 8/Scorpio being the house of Death and Regeneration, among other things. I have REBEL there.)
MOTHER. Way cool. I've seen some claim MOTHER in respect to Mother Nature and the environment. Good for you! HERMIT...I get it. Totally. I get in those moods, too. And what a cool explanation of KNIGHT! It sounds to me like it primarily works in your 6th House of Health and Occupation. What you describe sounds similar to Athen's description of his SOLDIER, especially the work part. But your sense of nobility and all that puts a different spin on how it's actually KNIGHT for you. quote:
Yet when I look at thief I am thinking someone who uses their wisdom and skill to overcome an obstacle. Thief has a lot of pride in their skill and they like to be discreet and work in the shadow. They do not seek glory but they did leave their mark on the deed they do.
What a neat take on THIEF! You know, I've not seen this kind of insight into Arkies and how it works within an individual for a LONG time...not even at Myss.com! You've got some great symbolic sight going there, Carrie! I have dreams about the kind of thing you describe, but I can't correlate it to any energy. I just chalked it up to it being the symbolic "I always use my head to get out of trouble". Since it's so recurring, maybe I should pay attention!
Btw, don't limit yourself to 12. Myss says there is only 12 in the first Wheel, but that's only HER system. There are Wheels outsdie of Wheels. It can get limiting if you're not careful. I'd rather look at Arkies like a buffet table. Which foods do I always pick, or find myself "eating"? (Can you say SP HEDONIST?! Amazing how things slip in! Or out!) We use much more than 12, although we tend to have certain main ones that seem to be repeating patterns. Thanks again for your thoughtful reply, Carrie!
Kali, care to share any insights with us?
CZ, I, too, have always related to the HERMIT/MYSTIC. I think mine are 2 separate Arkie energies, though. (Because I've seen HERMIT work in ways that are decidedly NOT spiritual in nature.) Now, I've seen you say that you felt that the only purpose of spirituality (in your eyes) was for comfort. It also appears that you're an Atheist, and may come from the standpoint that spirituality is dumb. (If I'm putting words in your mouth, I apologize. Correct me as needed.) So, if this is true, how do you see MYSTIC working in and with you, since MYSTIC is an Arkie that is directly aligned with the Divine? Also, how do you see yourself as a VAMPIRE, or being susceptible to VAMPIRES? I've always had a fascination with them too, as I mentioned. But when it came down to discerning if I merely liked an Archetype, or thought it was cool, and if I actually had a consistent pattern of operation with this energy, then I couldn't include it. Hmm. For me, I think it's because I'm so strong/Yang in life, that I have a secret fantasy of being dominated and seduced, especially by a VAMPIRE. (Not humiliation or violent. Benign domination. LOL!) Thanks for sharing your ideas! Here's a cool article about HERMIT if you're interested. I have tons of bookmarks on different Arkies. http://www.geocities.com/ninaleeb/tarot/hermit2.htm
Carlos The MONK makes perfect sense. I didn't catch you starting up a faux church, though. I totally get SERVANT, too. Even though in my 2nd Wheel SERVANT fell in the 3rd House of Self Expression (not sure about the accuracy of the 2nd Wheel), I have felt like an INDENTURED SERVANT to God. I feel like I'm on a cosmic tether, and I'm required to be of service to the masses when He beckons. No running away from it. Regarding CLOWN, that makes sense, too. Myss mentions in the book that she once went to a part and saw this guy being a CLOWN. Normally, CLOWNS like that bug her. But she looked deeper, and this guy, when he came out his "life of the party" CLOWN routine, was very down to Earth and great company. He explained the role of CLOWN to her with how he relates to groups.
Maybe you have CLOWN primarily in your 7th House of Relationships?
And TRICKSTER! AWESOME! I've finally have run across a kindred spirit in this area! All I can say is "I understand". I see TRICKSTER as a healer, who causes people's mask to slip. I've often played the part of TRICKSTER/PROVOCATEUR on Discussion Boards (I use it at Myss once in awhile!), but not so much here for some reason. Prolly cause there was a resident TRICKSTER already in place! Nah, it just isn't a part of my Contract here. Nothing like TRICKSTER energy to disrupt the status quo and awaken people out of complacency. ^5 I once read that TRICKSTERS bring chaos where there is calm, and calm where there is chaos. Neat, huh? Is it possible that the "feeling deceptive" that you associate with CLOWN is really a facet of TRICKSTER? (Since TRICKSTER can be a SHAPESHIFTER) I get the impression, especially in the past, that people think I'm deceptive or inauthentic, when the fact of the matter is that I have many facets, and they are ALL legitimate, and they are ALL me. (In a personality sense.) People LOVE predictability of behavior. Then they can control you. (Or attempt to, anyway). Do you identify with the SHAPESHIFTER aspects of TRICKSTER, by any chance? Here's a cool site dealing with everything TRICKSTER. http://members.aol.com/pmichaels/glorantha/foolsparadise.html (Not sure if I shared that link before, or not.)
dd1, that's a great take on DREAMER! I don't think I've ever come across anyone that's articulated how it works for them. I see what you mean about STUDENT and TEACHER. Do you see the world or life as a classroom, by any chance? Have a desire to teach? Myss has a neat story about the MUSICIAN Archetype vs. a musician, for example. She went to a concert where one gal clearly had the Arkie, and the other was just a musician. The former played with her soul, and animated the instrument and the music. The latter, while pleasant to listen to, lacked the "soul". This is what I feel distinguishes Archetype from job, role, or preference. (Although they may very well be one and the same.) "Good teachers" who stick in the minds of their students likely have the TEACHER Arkie. Those who just do it as a job, or are good at it but not "animated" by it, may just be teachers. Does that make sense? Archetypes and contracts are that which "animate" us...either in a "ruffle the feathers" way, or a positive response that jumps in the belly (I'm reminded of John the Baptist leaping in the belly of Elizabeth when Mary told her that she was pregnant), etc. Does that make sense?
UDOLPHO! Please go on!!!! I am totally transfixed by your post! One doesn't have to be limited to the Arkies that Myss lists. MOON sounds like a GREAT Archetype. Keep going about VAMPIRES and monsters! Like Carrie and the others, you've managed to beautifully capture how VAMPIRE works in and through it. I hope you don't get shy now that you've teased us so! That was so cool quote:
I think everyone should have a monster Archetype
I'm going to have to think on that one!
Re-making yourself through the ashes and destruction...maybe you have ALCHEMIST? And don't feel silly about your Arkies: they are simply patterns that you use in life for certain purposes. I think you've got a fascinating combo, actually! I think we as humans are truly like diamonds, although dirt and grime sometimes covers up the facets and the beauty.
John, do you really think you can get away with popping in here and not sharing anything?! Come come. |
Edited by - Synergy on 12 Mar 2003 8:04:09 PM |
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Synergy
Member
USA
4360 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 8:11:39 PM
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Btw, Cheetah: More about Tarot...
The funny thing is, I rarely do readings for myself. When I do, they are usually one card spreads that serve more as a meditation. I did a spread before the meeting with the pastor, but didn't take the time to even interpret it yet! It will be cool if it correlates with the meeting. (It was a 5 card spread). I think it was before Christmas since I've done a reading for myself.
For others...I've found a weird phenomenon. Most people usually don't go for straight insight and knowledge. It has to have razzmatazz accompanying it (Much like "prophetic" people bellowing and speaking King James...as if that's God native tongue. LOL). I mostly use my prophetic insights anymore with my teaching. But when it comes to personal divination, people like something solid and concrete to associate with divination: a crystal ball, runes, Tarot, etc. So I got into Tarot as an experiment to see if I could join my prophetic giftings with a concrete tool and see what happens. It's worked for some friends (who'd likely not listen if it was just a "Hey, I see this for you".) But even reading wise, I rarely do them for people. No one IRL knows I do it, even! (Except Athens)
I'm most comfortable sharing prophetic insights in person, and usually within some kind of teaching analogy. I've long learned that it's not my responsibility for them to "get it". I'm just an errand girl. (Wow, I'm preachin' to myself! I needed to hear that...) |
Edited by - Synergy on 12 Mar 2003 8:12:24 PM |
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john
Member
USA
3817 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 8:53:06 PM
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sorry synergy
i don't know a blessed thing about tarot or archetypes. i wish i knew what everybody is talking about, but i'm too lazy to read up on this
john 5/4/social/sexual/intp |
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jase
Member
USA
3488 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 8:54:35 PM
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Synergy - as far as the God archetype, I am basing that on the "God complex" that Fives/INTP's often have. To me it's basically the idea that for all the visible iron fists that dominate, there is a more subtle, invisible hand shaping things at a much larger level. Also, I've always been attached to gods, as symbols of power and extreme personalities, shapers of events, etc. My 4th grade teacher allowed me to specialize in Greek mythology for the entire year, and I never had more fun. I studied mythology for a few years after that and identified with such critters as Hades, Tezcatlipoca, Coyote, and Shiva.
Shadowishly, I designed my own religion when I was 13 based on the concept that we are all gods and control our own universe. Essentially it was new age thinking taken to a certain extreme, stripped of the phony all-is-one benevolence that provides both an ego control and psychological boost for naive initiates duped by the Ninish facade of the new age movement (fingers taking deep breath). I actually ran my concepts past a new age guru who gave me full approval. Months later I nearly committed suicide in an attempt to realize my full powers of godhood. There's a deeper shadow motive to that as well, but that's another topic.
Alchemist: as part of authentic Christianity I believe in the progressive transformation of the spirit into a state of eventual deity, which is the doctrine of Theosis (a nice contrast to the new age corruption of this principle). For obvious reasons Theosis is forever ongoing and can never reach completion or graduation, which permanently protects the God/human separation, while allowing one to partake in the divine nature and inch ever closer to God and ever beyond our former state.
Destroyer: I have a lifelong urge to destroy, this was an easy call. When I don't like something I immediately reach for the Destroy button, regardless of whether such a button is present, or whether I actually push it. I indentify with Phoenix to a lesser extent, since sometimes I wish to remain in ashes.
Wounded Healer: a few devastating events that threatened to destroy me permanently caused a stir internally for self renewal. I adamantly resisted all support and sought my own victory. It's the only healing I know.
Guide - this is par for the course when on any "path", especially those ranked in esoteric systems. I see Guide as a more subtle, intuitive facilitating of whatever spiritual value you deem worthy to offer to whatever target is deemed worthy to receive it. This is one archetype I'm not that comfortable with, because I don't feel ready to be a "guide" of any sort, but I do realize the importance of the cycle.
As far as Teacher, I didn't identify with that because I see it as more parental, more step by step. And also, I don't seek students. I don't know what the heck I'd teach them. Everything needs a context.
Vampire is the nature of my sexual mode (second to my social variant). I've emptied a few necks at the cost of a few stakes in the heart. I'm not particularly proud of this arkie, but it's there.
Student: yes I do follow teachers, but everyone can be a teacher. Aside from that, I've had a select few mentors that continue to make an impact in my life. They were actually guides moreso than teachers, but my role with them was as student/rebel/judge/prince, kind of like Luke when he was acting punkish with Yoda. I'm selfish and would rather learn than teach, so I don't mind playing dumb with a fool if it causes him to spill the treasure he unwittingly possesses.
Prince: my attachment to prince is similar to the god archetype, it includes the whole entitlement/elitist/power trip shadow as well. The role of "ruler in training" is a very important ideal for me, and one that I've always identified with more or less. Along with the reluctance to try to graduate to more mature roles such as mentor or king. I don't really have a desire to lead, teach, or rule others. I want the unreasonable, which is for the right people to come into my life for the right reasons, and for everyone else to go away.
There are some fairy tales that resonated with me, but for some reason none come to mind at the moment. I like werewolves and dragons, and usually identify with monsters if given a choice. |
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Synergy
Member
USA
4360 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 9:03:03 PM
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John, look at the list of Arkies from that one Myss link, and just pick the ones that resonate with you. What superheroes did you adore as a child? What kind of movies do you like? What characters are you drawn to? Do you ever say anything that can be likened to a character? (Like me slipping with food analogies. Classic HEDONIST.)
Jase, I've blown my brain for now. I'll no doubt comment/interrogate you later. Thanks for sharing! I will say that fairy tale wise, I always resonated with Beauty and the Beast (Loving the unlovable...that which is beastly), and The Emperor's New Clothes. I always saw myself in the role of the little boy saying 'Hey! The King has no clothes!' I'm not sure if that's TRICKSTER or if that's PROPHET. I once shared this on the Myss board, and someone said how she hated that little boy, and he should have left everyone to their magical, grand illusions! Goes to show that we often see life through Archetypal lenses, and what we see is often not what OTHERS may see.
John, fairy tales are a great source to see Arkies, too. Anyone resonate with you? Comic books? Which movies move you emotionally or make you "animated"...either with anger, passion, love, hope, etc? Those are good clues, too. (See? That was my DETECTIVE sneaking in! )
Thanks again, Jase, and I'll get back to you when I recover my brain. |
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Kali
Member
2703 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2003 : 11:01:25 PM
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| synergy, i've spent my alloted time here tonight posting tidbits and resources, but i'll be back to post the couple of insights i have tomorrow. |
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Seeing Yourself and Life Symbolically
