| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
goodmourning
Member
228 Posts |
 Posted - 04 Nov 2009 : 11:20:36 AM
|
One of the best pointers to whether type is ingrained or not, would be case studies of identical twins. I'm a fraternal twin, my brother is a 2w3 and I'm a 5w4. So very different people our whole lives. So, doesn't tell us much.
Has there been any studies on the occurrence of similar personality types and homozygotic twins? Or does anyone know identical twins, and can tell us if their types are the same or not? |
|
|
Classi
Member
331 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2009 : 7:50:12 PM
|
| I know a pair of identical twins, both 9s, I always thought that maybe being twins had contributed to them being nines, since it's harder to form an individual identity if you have to share everything/ are always overlooked etc |
 |
|
|
carlos
Member
3565 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2009 : 9:09:17 PM
|
thinking along these same lines, i did an informal survey a few years ago and identical twins often turned out to be different enneatypes. rather than overturning the belief that we are "born" our type, people came out with the hypothesis that our type develops in the womb enviornment-- thus, from this point of view, we are born with it, but it's not strictly genetically predetermined, whatever that means.
something that people noticed was that, although they seemed to be different enneatypes, the identical twins often were types that had a certain similarity in terms of certain factors... for instance, a 1 and an 8 (both argumentative and strong-willed), or a 2 and a 7 (both extroverts and positive outlook), etc.
i've sometimes thought that there are at least two sets of personality types: biological types and enneatypes. the two are related but not the same. so, introversion or negative outlook may be somehow biological, but the person may turn out a 4 or a 5 or a phobic 6 of some kind.
Ambassador to the Savage Tribes |
|
|
|
carlos
Member
3565 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2009 : 9:12:14 PM
|
oh, and something else about identical twins studies. they've found that identical twins reared apart are often more similar than those reared in the same household... theoretically, growing up together makes people assert their individuality by becoming different, while if a twin doesn't have that influence, they just develop in a straightforward way-- and in such cases, their personality resembles that of their twin.
Ambassador to the Savage Tribes |
|
|
|
Art_Skidmore
Member
13305 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2009 : 9:24:23 PM
|
the Roloffs...Little People Big World television series offers a weekly look at fraternal twins Jeremy and Zachary with dwarf parents where one is a dwarf and the other is not.
|
|
|
|
goodmourning
Member
228 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2009 : 10:05:20 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by carlos
thinking along these same lines, i did an informal survey a few years ago and identical twins often turned out to be different enneatypes. rather than overturning the belief that we are "born" our type, people came out with the hypothesis that our type develops in the womb enviornment-- thus, from this point of view, we are born with it, but it's not strictly genetically predetermined, whatever that means.
something that people noticed was that, although they seemed to be different enneatypes, the identical twins often were types that had a certain similarity in terms of certain factors... for instance, a 1 and an 8 (both argumentative and strong-willed), or a 2 and a 7 (both extroverts and positive outlook), etc.
i've sometimes thought that there are at least two sets of personality types: biological types and enneatypes. the two are related but not the same. so, introversion or negative outlook may be somehow biological, but the person may turn out a 4 or a 5 or a phobic 6 of some kind.
Ambassador to the Savage Tribes
I've theorized that if we are not born a specific type, we atleast have the propensity towards a certain grouping of types. Such as triads, outlook, hornovian, or whatever. |
|
|
|
4wants8
Member
2402 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2009 : 11:30:04 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by goodmourning
One of the best pointers to whether type is ingrained or not, would be case studies of identical twins. I'm a fraternal twin, my brother is a 2w3 and I'm a 5w4. So very different people our whole lives. So, doesn't tell us much.
Yeah, my brothers are fraternal twins (1w9/5w6/4w5 and 6w5/9w1/4w5).
“Elizabeth and Jessica were guides to another universe, a place full of possibility and good hair.”
Diablo Cody Sweet Success
http://community.livejournal.com/1bruce1/229012.html#cutid1 |
|
|
|
skunk
Member
2131 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2009 : 06:58:31 AM
|
Good thread.
Going on gut instincts (for whatever those are worth), I also feel that genetics would influence temperament rather than E type. Most of the theories of introversion, extraversion and so on would seem to be complimentary to a biogenetic explanatory paradigm, I think, whereas the fixations strike me as coming from a qualitatively different place. I've noticed that although I'm deeply withdrawn I share my father's aggression, but it is much more walled up and less assertive (he's a 2w1 who could pass for a cp 6w5).
I think it's quite plausible that the womb environment can profoundly influence lifelong disposition -- and it's been overlooked in favour of the post-natal focus of psychoanalysis (obviously) because it's barely amenable even to causal theories, let alone investigation.
As for what determines a triadic outlook such as anxiety is pretty hard to unravel (pre, or post-natal?) though I can see the Inner Triangle as being involved in the matter of what it is to be human and have human awareness. Some old studies with non-human primates suggested the emergence of anxiety for example, even at that early level.(?)
I've a feeling that genetics provide the most skeletal framework only and are our largest area of overlap with our ancestors.
--
Back on topic, genetic/twin studies of SZPD disorders are also of interest, in as far as they can actually be correlated with E types.
|
Edited by - skunk on 05 Nov 2009 07:22:50 AM |
|
|
|
baba
Member
1132 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2009 : 09:53:08 AM
|
Do have identical twins the same Mbti ?
What I mean to say is following suggestion: let's say both are Intp
one Enneatype 5 other 6 or 9..
Just interested..
Fig 2. Heritability for nine psychological traits as estimated from twin studies. All sources are twins raised together (sample size shown inside bars). As outlined above, identical twins (MZ twins) are twice as genetically similar as fraternal twins (DZ twins) and so heritability (h2) is approximately twice the difference in correlation between MZ and DZ twins. Unique environmental variance (e2) is reflected by the degree to which identical twins raised together are dissimilar, and is approximated by 1-MZ correlation. The effect of shared environment (c2) contributes to similarity in all cases and is approximated by the DZ correlation minus the difference between MZ and DZ correlations.
A parent must also not be afraid to hang himself. |
Edited by - baba on 05 Nov 2009 10:03:27 AM |
|
|
|
Scorpionical
Member
4596 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2009 : 11:55:15 AM
|
| Aki Mizu and Liquidzilla are identical twins on here and they are different types. I knew identical twins types 7w6 and 3w2 in school. |
|
|
|
baba
Member
1132 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2009 : 10:05:24 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Scorpionical
Aki Mizu and Liquidzilla are identical twins on here and they are different types. I knew identical twins types 7w6 and 3w2 in school.
Did'nt know, what are their Mbti types ?
A parent must also not be afraid to hang himself. |
Edited by - baba on 06 Nov 2009 10:16:12 AM |
|
|
|
Stormy
Member
United Kingdom
12541 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2009 : 10:11:12 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by baba
Did'nt know, what's their Mbti types ?
Aki claims INFJ; liquid, INTJ.
[Stormy] |
|
|
|
baba
Member
1132 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2009 : 10:18:46 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Stormy
quote:
Originally posted by baba
Did'nt know, what's their Mbti types ?
Aki claims INFJ; liquid, INTJ.
[Stormy]
Pity, sorry joking..
Are they real identical, they seem a bit different.. exluding the glass of course
A parent must also not be afraid to hang himself. |
Edited by - baba on 06 Nov 2009 10:19:41 AM |
|
|
|
Stormy
Member
United Kingdom
12541 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2009 : 10:38:48 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by baba
Are they real identical, they seem a bit different.. exluding the glass of course
Even identical twins have differences.
[Stormy] |
|
|
|
Estranged Protractor
Member
USA
2670 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2009 : 11:14:12 PM
|
Yes, there was such a study (I looked up the E a while ago on my previous school's academic journal search tool).
It would take me probably days to find the study again (if I could), and I don't have the time to do that now. The results though, studying something on the order of 10 to 20 identical twin pairs, had all but one pair show up as the same type.
The one which didn't had a 3 and a 5 as their types.
Given the difficulties with accurately typing people, and my lack of a reference, you can take this as you want. (ie. I could easily see a 9 testing as the same type as their twin even if they were not, or the "5" of the 3/5 twins above actually being another 3).
Type itself doesn't seem to be overly hereditary, and there are same type couples who've had children of different types, so to what extent genetics and epigenetics plays a role even in identical twins is still an worthwhile question to ask.
______________________________________
Verbifying nouns is my favorite adjectivity! |
|
|
|
Scorpionical
Member
4596 Posts |
Posted - 15 Nov 2009 : 01:20:12 AM
|
Well I guess they might have both been 7w6 or type 3 but they had very different temperaments.
quote:
Pity, sorry joking..
Are they real identical, they seem a bit different.. exluding the glass of course
Oh of course. That frustrates me. They seemed like real people |
Edited by - Scorpionical on 15 Nov 2009 01:33:05 AM |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
Type and Identical Twins
